Biographical Listing/Talk

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Don't. The 'von' is definitely part of the last name. --Yooden

When adding people with German surnames beginning with von, put them under the letter for the main part of their name; i.e. Otto von Bismarck goes under B, not V. You probably should also write Bismarck, Otto von rather than von Bismarck, Otto. -- Simon J Kissane

and I don't know WHAT the information technologist position (they used to be librarians. *sigh*) is on VON and VAN and such. von Bismarck, Otto; Bismarck, Otto von; cross-references?

This discussion whether the page with this biographical listing is at all needed just supports the importance of metadata system. With the metadata system this kind of pages would be generated automatically saving all the manual page creation process.
Just one word of metadata "biography" will make it work like a charm.
No more error-prone,mundane and incomplete listings.

Agreed. I'd love to see such a system put into place. -- STG

Regarding Jesus Christ: I think he should be alphabetized under 'J', just like Alexander the Great should be under the 'A', Scipio (often called Scipio Africanus) under 'S' and Richard Lionheart under 'R'. Although I must admit that there are some less clear-cut cases: Julius Caesar should probably be under J, but is often put under C (Julius is his family name), while Napoleon is often put under N although his family name was Bonaparte. -- Andre Engels

I think this page serves as a meta-page, like Wikipedia FAQ and Recent Changes: it's a page more about Wikipedia than an entry within it. Coupled with a page chronicling advances in society, it might eventually serve as an alternative category scheme. Just some thoughts. --KQ

To close the 'von'-issue: I have spoken to a bookseller and she said in bibliography it's 'Bismarck, Otto von' if the 'von' is in small caps, but 'Le Carré, John' otherwise. Note that this is bibliography, but it's good enough for me.

This rule for German "von" does not apply to the Dutch "van" or "van der" - the latter is not a mark of nobility. To complicate matters further, there are (Low?) German names like Ludwig VAN Beethoven. - clasqm

Antoni van Leeuwenhoek is always refered to as just Leeuwenhoek rather than as van Leeuwenhoek, despite his being Dutch rather than German. I would guess this is only because his name is awkward enough without the van, but it should properly be van Leeuwenhoek. I put him under 'L' for now, though. - Tim